Peter Soulsby (Leicester South, Lab)
At the heart of the hon. Gentleman's argument is the assertion that a person's religious belief is, in many respects, very similar to that person's political belief or—this example was given earlier—his or her support for a football club. Does he accept that many people's religious beliefs are much more fundamental than their political beliefs, or even their support for football clubs? Are not those beliefs fundamentally connected to their family, culture and heritage? Indeed, in many cases their religious beliefs are even more fundamental to their sense of identity than their race.

Dominic Grieve (Beaconsfield, Con)
Some would argue—and I think surveys demonstrate it—that many people's political views are inherited. That certainly applies to the political parties that they may choose to support.

Douglas Hogg (Sleaford & North Hykeham, Con)
Look who's talking.

Dominic Grieve (Beaconsfield, Con)
Of course, some may be apostates when it comes to the political views of their forefathers. Nevertheless, one's political views are closely bound up with one's philosophical outlook. But I would hate that to be treated as a defining characteristic, so immutable that it was entitled to special protection. What worries me about the approach of the hon. Member for Leicester, South (Sir Peter Soulsby) is that it does suggest that someone's religious outlook is immutable. It suggests that we can compartmentalise society into a series of blocks of individuals believing certain things, which deserve to be preserved in aspic for all time without challenge.

I believe that in the pluralistic society that we are rapidly becoming in this country—indeed, we may have already reached that point—we should be going in the opposite direction. Far from there being special protection, people must face the fact that their personal point of view on matters as sensitive as religion, for instance, will come in for robust criticism, discussion and discourse. If we embark on the road down which I fear the Bill will take us, we will institutionalise difference, curb debate and thus produce a far less flexible society than the society we undoubtedly need if we are to go forward and prosper.

Peter Soulsby (Leicester South, Lab)
I certainly do not think that a religious outlook needs be immutable, but I believe it to be fundamental. It is, I believe, fundamental to how people identify themselves, and fundamental in a way that is particularly relevant to the Bill—fundamental to how others identify them and promote hatred of them. Surely the purpose of the Bill is to protect those who are identified by others, and by themselves, according to their religion. Surely we should extend the protection that already exists in the context of their identification in terms of race.

Dominic Grieve (Beaconsfield, Con)
I appreciate that we are dealing with religious hatred. We should bear in mind, however, that 200 years ago those in this Chamber—or rather down the Corridor, where the Chamber was then—were living in a society in which, notwithstanding the tolerance accorded to some dissenters and indeed to small Jewish minorities, there was a consensus, institutionalised by Parliament, that certain Christian beliefs contained in the 39 Articles of religion must be imposed for the sake of social conformity, and to maintain the body politic. That is the state in which our country then was.

Over the last 200 years we have seen a dramatic change, not just in the extent of the tolerance accorded to others who wish to practise other religious beliefs. The country is in the process of a massive transformation: multiculturalism and religious views are important not just to small minority groups, but to substantial sections of society. I must tell the hon. Gentleman that in those circumstances I think it is particularly important for freedom of discourse to be maintained, including freedom to criticise in vehement terms. We must all get used to that. If we do not, we shall be moving in the wrong direction.